Should Baha'i Funds be used to support CEDAW

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hugobjzq
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Should Baha'i Funds be used to support CEDAW

Postby hugobjzq » Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:23 pm

CEDAW is the "Convention for the Elimination of Discrimination Against Women"; an international treaty. Article 12 of CEDAW says that women must have the right in family planning, specifically to "limit the number" of children. This means abortion on demand. Every court that has interpreted CEDAW, interprets Article 12 as abortion on demand.

The Committee at the United Nations that oversees CEDAW, has said that Article 12 means abortion on demand. The nation of Colombia ratified CEDAW, and was told they must allow abortion on demand, because of Article 12.

The Office of External Affairs in Washington D.C., an arm of the NSA of the United States, is also the "Ratification Office" of CEDAW in the United States. Baha'i Funds are being used to try to get CEDAW ratified in the United States.

Do YOU believe this is a good expenditure of Baha'i Funds?

brettz9
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Postby brettz9 » Sun Mar 16, 2008 2:09 am

In the Bahá'í community methods and mechanisms are provided within the Administrative Order to elicit and make the best use of the ideas and hopes of individual believers in ways that enrich the pattern of Bahá'í life without disrupting the community. There may be many occasions on which individual believers are permitted or even encouraged by their Assembly to promote their ideas, but independent attempts by individual Bahá'ís to canvass support for their views among their fellow believers are destructive of the unity of the Cause. To attempt, in opposition to the institutions of the Faith, to form constituencies for certain proposals and programmes may not necessarily lead to Covenant-breaking, but it is a societal factor for disruption against which the Covenant is designed to protect the Faith. It is the process by which parties are formed and by which a religion is riven into contending sects.

(The Universal House of Justice, 1989 Jun 21, 'Dialogue', 'A Modest Proposal' etc)


The decision to support CEDAW was taken by a Nat. Assembly. If you have a concern about it and were an enrolled Baha'i, you could, as our Writings suggest, make a suggestion or even raise a concern to the House of Justice. We are to abide by the decisions of our Assemblies and not challenge them even if they are wrong, given the assurance in our Writings that the truth will come up if we obey in unity. That wouldn't prevent you from raising the question at Feast, appealing even to the House of Justice, but then we are to abide by their decision!

Brett

British_Bahai
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Re: Should Baha'i Funds be used to support CEDAW

Postby British_Bahai » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:59 am

Darrick_Evenson wrote:CEDAW is the "Convention for the Elimination of Discrimination Against Women"; an international treaty. Article 12 of CEDAW says that women must have the right in family planning, specifically to "limit the number" of children. This means abortion on demand. Every court that has interpreted CEDAW, interprets Article 12 as abortion on demand.

The Committee at the United Nations that oversees CEDAW, has said that Article 12 means abortion on demand. The nation of Colombia ratified CEDAW, and was told they must allow abortion on demand, because of Article 12.

hmm... well i was interested because ive never heard of such a thing.
When i looked up article 12 i couldnt find the specifics you were referring to about abortion.
This is all that it says:

http://www.un.org/womenwatch/daw/cedaw/ ... #article12
Article 12

1. States Parties shall take all appropriate measures to eliminate discrimination against women in the field of health care in order to ensure, on a basis of equality of men and women, access to health care services, including those related to family planning.

2. Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph I of this article, States Parties shall ensure to women appropriate services in connection with pregnancy, confinement and the post-natal period, granting free services where necessary, as well as adequate nutrition during pregnancy and lactation.

Where did you read that? can you please post up the text ?
thanks in advance.

hugobjzq
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Re: Should Baha'i Funds be used to support CEDAW

Postby hugobjzq » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:54 pm

To follow the NSA "for the sake of Unity" and not condemn their violations of Baha'i principles, would be like if the NSA said "ok, slavery is good" and then NOT saying anything. YOU like what they are doing. That is why you are not complaining. The absolute HYPOCRISY is disgusting!!!


The Committee that oversees CEDAW, an official UN office, has told countries that have ratified CEDAW that they are violating the treaty by denying abortion on demand to women in their country. The language is purpusely vague, but Ireland and Columbia who have ratified it have been told that the term right to "access to health care services" in "family planning" includes "termination of pregnancy" options at any stage of pregnancy as well as all forms of birth control.


british_bahai wrote:
Darrick_Evenson wrote:CEDAW is the "Convention for the Elimination of Discrimination Against Women"; an international treaty. Article 12 of CEDAW says that women must have the right in family planning, specifically to "limit the number" of children. This means abortion on demand. Every court that has interpreted CEDAW, interprets Article 12 as abortion on demand.

The Committee at the United Nations that oversees CEDAW, has said that Article 12 means abortion on demand. The nation of Colombia ratified CEDAW, and was told they must allow abortion on demand, because of Article 12.

hmm... well i was interested because ive never heard of such a thing.
When i looked up article 12 i couldnt find the specifics you were referring to about abortion.
This is all that it says:

http://www.un.org/womenwatch/daw/cedaw/ ... #article12
Article 12

1. States Parties shall take all appropriate measures to eliminate discrimination against women in the field of health care in order to ensure, on a basis of equality of men and women, access to health care services, including those related to family planning.

2. Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph I of this article, States Parties shall ensure to women appropriate services in connection with pregnancy, confinement and the post-natal period, granting free services where necessary, as well as adequate nutrition during pregnancy and lactation.

Where did you read that? can you please post up the text ?
thanks in advance.

hugobjzq
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How the United Nations "interprets" Article 12 of

Postby hugobjzq » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:01 pm

[Editor note: ] The text posted here was copied verbatim from http://www.nrlc.org/Federal/ForeignAid/ ... 20107.html "While the word "abortion" does not appear...Laws that ban abortion have just that effect and that purpose." As this text was not attributed nor its copyright status asserted by the poster, the text has been removed. Further attempts to post copyrighted material (especially in large quantitiy and without attribution) may be deleted immediately.]

brettz9
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Postby brettz9 » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:39 pm

YOU like what they are doing.


I'm curious when and how you acquired your telepathic abilities.

If you continue this discussion as though you are a Baha'i ("unenrolled" is not a category our Faith recognizes), this discussion will terminate (as with your other posts that you've been repeatedly told to stop posting).

We've already shown you quotations which express the Baha'i perspective on what to do with obedience to our Assemblies and what recourse we have if we disagree with them. While a non-Baha'i is most welcome to express their disagreement with our own Writings, pursuing this further by someone claiming to be a Baha'i will only cause further argumentation, as your other threads have historically done.

I don't know about Jonah, but I've had enough and aim to act accordingly.

Brett

[<b>Note from Jonah:</b> Mr. Evenson and I have had enough correspondence, both private and public, that we both know where each other stands on these issues. Brett, you're free to do as you see fit. Thanks, -Jonah, 3/17/2008]


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