Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

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onepence~2
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Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:33 pm

We hear the phrase ...

" Cry out to Zion " ... also Zion is mentioned elsewhere

Explain Zion ...

now ... i could be way way way

way way way

way off base ....

but recently i have been thinking that The Baha'i World Administration Center is Zion ...

is that right ... ??? ... pretty profound implications if true ...

Zion is already here ... in our midst ... but we do not call it Zion today

because ... ???

????

because ... ??? ... no official designation of ... ???

no official designation from ... ???

Is it possible that future generations of men will refer to

The Baha'i World Administration Center as Zion ??

if so .... WOW ...

BritishBahai
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby BritishBahai » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:53 pm

Because (to the best of my knowledge), Zion is the old word and was the word used when those particular Bahai writings were written. They were written in the 1850s or whenever. Zion was the word used back then.

Zion refers to a geographical place. Now if the name has changed, you have no other choice but to use the modern accepted country name.

Its the modern day equivalent of calling Russia as USSR.
Or referring to Iran as "Persia".

I have no quotes to back myself up with. Ahem. lol..
Thats my take on it, anyway.
"I have desired only what Thou didst desire, and love only what Thou dost love"

coatofmanycolours
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby coatofmanycolours » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:55 pm

Onepence; Yet another subtle suggestion, this time making use of the emotional
punch-words 'Zion' and 'Zionism' to hint of a link with the spiritual institutions of the
Faith.

Do you do this sort of thing for a living?

-Peter

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:30 pm

coatofmanycolours wrote:Onepence; Yet another subtle suggestion, this time making use of the emotional
punch-words 'Zion' and 'Zionism' to hint of a link with the spiritual institutions of the
Faith.

Do you do this sort of thing for a living?

-Peter


*smile*

geesh ... if only we could make a livin off our writings ...

lol ... but unfortunately He, as of yet, has not made that decree ...

no ... just a guy that loves to think about his Lord ...

however ... you are right ... that the term Zion , in today's world is emotional ...

We suppose that is why we asked our question ...

i want to understand my emotion when i hear the word Zion ...

especially when i hear the words

"Cry out to Zion"

what is it that phrase about ?

What is Zion ... why are people/us/me ... so emotional over the term Zion ...

if we are so emotional over something ... shouldn't we try to understand our emotions ...

why we fel what we feel ... why we "Cry out to Zion" ...

if we do not understand what the terms mean ... then ... terms become essentially meaningless ...

is that what we want ... "Cry out to Zion" to be meaningless ... ??? ... just can't see that happening for us/me/we

so ... what does "Cry out to Zion" mean ,,,

What is Zion ?

we contend that The Baha'i World Administration Center is Zion ...
we are unsure if our contention is correct
thus we asked the question.

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:36 pm

BritishBahai wrote:Because (to the best of my knowledge), Zion is the old word and was the word used when those particular Bahai writings were written. They were written in the 1850s or whenever. Zion was the word used back then.

Zion refers to a geographical place. Now if the name has changed, you have no other choice but to use the modern accepted country name.

Its the modern day equivalent of calling Russia as USSR.
Or referring to Iran as "Persia".

I have no quotes to back myself up with. Ahem. lol..
Thats my take on it, anyway.


thanks for the heads up

Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zion

Zion ... is a term that most often designates the Land of Israel and its capital, Jerusalem. The word is found in texts dating back almost three millennia. It commonly referred to a specific mountain near Jerusalem (Mount Zion), on which stood a Jebusite fortress of the same name that was conquered by David and was named the City of David.

The term Zion came to designate the area of Jerusalem where the fortress stood, and later ...

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:43 pm

"The name Zion appears 154 times in the Tanakh (Hebrew Bible)."

"This could be a literal place such as in Ethiopia for Rastafari for example. For others, it has taken on a more spiritual meaning—a safe spiritual homeland ... "

coatofmanycolours
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby coatofmanycolours » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:18 pm

Onepence and other friends; I have an idea that Baha'u'llah is making reference to the symbolic
'city of God' spoken of in the Kitab-i-Iqan:

"That city is none other than the Word of God revealed in every age and dispensation.
In the days of Moses it was the Pentateuch;
in the days of Jesus the Gospel;
in the days of Muhammad the Messenger of God the Qur'an;
in this day the Bayan;
and in the dispensation of Him Whom God will make manifest His own Book
-- the Book unto which all the Books of former Dispensations must needs be referred,
the Book which standeth amongst them all transcendent and supreme.

In these cities spiritual sustenance is bountifully provided, and incorruptible delights have
been ordained. The food they bestow is the bread of heaven, and the Spirit they impart
is God's imperishable blessing. Upon detached souls they bestow the gift of Unity, enrich
the destitute, and offer the cup of knowledge unto them who wander in the wilderness
of ignorance. All the guidance, the blessings, the learning, the understanding, the faith,
and certitude, conferred upon all that is in heaven and on earth, are hidden and treasured
within these Cities.

Baha'u'llah : The Kitab-i-Iqan p. 199

coatofmanycolours
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby coatofmanycolours » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:26 pm

and Abdu'l-Baha explains the figurative meaning of Jerusalem, that is the spiritual essence of the law of God that would descend from God in the end times:

The Holy of Holies, according to the terminology of the people of wisdom, is the essence
of the Divine Law, and the heavenly and true teachings of the Lord, which have not been
changed in the cycle of any Prophet, as it was before explained.

The sanctuary of Jerusalem is likened to the reality of the Law of God, which is the Holy of
Holies; and all the laws, conventions, rites and material regulations are the city of Jerusalem
-- this is why it is called the heavenly Jerusalem. Briefly, as in this cycle the Sun of Reality will
make the light of God shine with the utmost splendor, therefore, the essence of the teachings
of God will be realized in the world of existence, and the darkness of ignorance and want of
knowledge will be dispelled. The world will become a new world, and enlightenment will prevail.
So the Holy of Holies will appear.
[1 Rev. 11:19.]

"And the temple of God was opened in heaven"[1] means also that by the diffusion of the divine
teachings, the appearance of these heavenly mysteries, and the rising of the Sun of Reality, the
doors of success and prosperity will be opened in all directions, and the signs of goodness and
heavenly benedictions will be made plain.

Abdu'l-Baha : Some Answered Questions

coatofmanycolours
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby coatofmanycolours » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:27 pm

"And there was seen in His temple the ark of His Testament"[1] -- that is to say, the Book
of His Testament will appear in His Jerusalem, the Epistle of the Covenant [2] will be established,
and the meaning of the Testament and of the Covenant will become evident. The renown of God
will overspread the East and West, and the proclamation of the Cause of God will fill the world.

The violators of the Covenant will be degraded and dispersed, and the faithful cherished and
glorified, for they cling to the Book of the Testament and are firm and steadfast in the Covenant.
[1 Rev. 11:19.]

[2 One of the works of Bahá'u'lláh, in which He expressly points to 'Abdu'l-Bahá as being the
One to Whom all must turn after His death.]

Abdu'l-Baha : Some Answered Questions

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:39 pm

"the meaning of the Testament and of the Covenant"

The Baha'i World Administration Center and The Universal House of Justice

Zion

yes/no/maybe

????

coatofmanycolours
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby coatofmanycolours » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:58 pm

Baha'u'llah sometimes referred to a place responding to the presence of God.
He would personify such a place, for symbolic purposes.

In the case of Palestine, His final place of imprisonment, He described it as being
joyful because of the wonderful things which God revealed there through the
Promised One expected by all Faiths. The place is responding to the revelation.
One unique part of that revelation is the Order of Baha'u'llah, spoken of also by
the Bab. The place, Zion, is joyful because the laws and teachings from God are
made plain.

-Peter

"This is the Day in which He Who held converse with God hath attained the light of
the Ancient of Days, and quaffed the pure waters of reunion from this Cup that hath
caused the seas to swell.

Say: By the one true God! Sinai is circling round the Dayspring of Revelation, while from
the heights of the Kingdom the Voice of the Spirit of God is heard proclaiming:

"Bestir yourselves, ye proud ones of the earth, and hasten ye unto Him."

Carmel hath, in this Day, hastened in longing adoration to attain His court, whilst from the
heart of Zion there cometh the cry:

"The promise is fulfilled. That which had been announced in the holy Writ of God, the Most
Exalted, the Almighty, the Best-Beloved, is made manifest.""

Baha'u'llah : The Kitab-i-Aqdas

brettz9
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby brettz9 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 11:12 pm

Sorry, just my own quick take without having read the thread fully, I think Zion may be Baha'u'llah's appeal to Jews, Christians, and Muslims who hold Zion as an important if not the most important spiritual capitol, continuing on with His appeal for them to recognize the New Jerusalem such as was foretold in the Bible...

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Tue Mar 24, 2009 11:32 pm

"The promise is fulfilled"

yes ... my point exactly ... "The promise is fulfilled" ... thus Zion is here ...

yet none we know of say Zion is here ...

Why is that ? ... is it because we do not believe it to be a physical place ...

but clearly in past Scripture Zion was a physical place ...

Why is it that we do not say Zion is here ?

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Thu Mar 26, 2009 8:27 pm

Zion

the smell of freshly cut grass
the tint of colour from a raindrop
our broken stick

all parts particles and spacial relations

Zion

our home

how we yearn

*smile*

yet are so week ... still Zion forever ... in our heart

in our dreams

in every waking thought & deed

Zion

forever we pray ...

keep thou whom holds the Mystery
safe from harms way

amen

onepence~2
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Re: Q : Explain Baha'i concept of Zion

Postby onepence~2 » Fri Apr 10, 2009 12:48 pm



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