THE MANIFESTATIONS OF SPIRITUAL FACT AND REALITY IN TRUE REL

All research or scholarship questions
Baha'i Warrior
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Postby Baha'i Warrior » Wed Sep 20, 2006 12:25 pm

Richard:

You said:

"Indeed, if we do not doubt the factual existence of God, why would we doubt he is our Perfect Personal Creator Father who makes himself spiritually manifest to us in the ideal truth and goodness of his most devout followers?"

Just wondering, what inspired you to write this? You're speaking generally, but is there a particular kind of people that you are referring to?

curt
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Location: Iowa

Postby curt » Wed Sep 20, 2006 9:00 pm

Hi Richard

Enjoyed your thoughts. Your insights reminded me of Baha'u'llah's central point of the Kitab-i-Iqan which Baha'u'llah poses as a question as follows:

...is not the object of every Revelation to effect a transformation in the whole character of mankind, a transformation that shall manifest itself both outwardly and inwardly, that shall afffect both its inner life and external conditions? For if the character of mankind be not changed, the futility of God's universal Manifestations would be apparent. - pp 240-241

Thou art my Creator, O my God. Am I Thy creation? A little something to think about.

All the best,

Curt

Baha'i Warrior
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Postby Baha'i Warrior » Wed Sep 27, 2006 9:52 am

Richard:

You said:

richard wrote:For what meaning and values do our lives have without true, beautiful, and good relationships rooted in God's Divine and unifying love? And, we must want to do this voluntarily, of our own freewill choice because it is the right thing to do for its own sake, and why would we want to do anything less when it is in the best interest of all of us?


This is all true, it's what the Writings state.

What if, for the sake of argument, someone doesn't believe in God. What motivation does he have to be moral and obey the law, other than staying out of trouble? There is a debate over this question, so I'm not the first to ask (or ponder) it. What would the response be? Would the correct response be: since for him there is supposedly no God, and if no one is watching what he does, he should do anything he pleases that maximizes pleasure and reduces pain and suffering, even if by unethical or immoral means? Religion provides mankind with guidance pointing to what is right and what is wrong. Some persons seems to think they can reject religion and pick which morals they still want to keep, but they doesn't realize where they originally came from! In fact, they would emphatically deny this, that morals and values were initially derived from religion.

Or the other (or another) response might be that he should adhere to morals and obey the law because in the long run this will lead to his ultimate happiness. However, this scenario seems unlikely given that Baha'u'llah states (in Gleanings) that we should not trust anyone who does not believe in God. Certainly there are (or we might postulate there to be) exceptions, but very few most likely given Baha'u'llah's statement. We may think someone to be honest and moral, but God knows him best and he could just be putting on an act, for example.

If anyone on this forum has the answer to this question, it's you, Richard :).


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