Claim of Ahmad as the Messiah

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Claim of Ahmad as the Messiah

Postby iranpour » Fri Apr 18, 2014 2:11 pm

There was a thread in the “Baha'i Forums” with the title “Claim of Ahmad as the Messiah” which is written by a follower of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian, who had first claimed to be Muhaddath [Narrator (of Traditions), Innovator…] and then claimed he was himself both, of the Promised Ones of Muslims, namely MAHDI and the RETURN OF JESUS (Isa), Those Promised One Who in Muslim’s Traditions (AHADITH), are two different personalities believed to appear successively, one after another, first, MAHDI and then ISA. The followers eventually split into two groups, those who are living in Lahore, are called Anjuman Ishaate Islam or Lahori Party. This group believes him a REFORMER, while the other group know him as a PROPHET.

Our Ahmadi friend has written:
Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, founder of the Ahmadiyya muslim movement, accepted as the Promised Messiah and Mahdi in Ahmadiyya. AHMADI MUSLIMS BELIEVE THAT THE PROPHECIES CONCERNING THE MAHDI AND THE SECOND COMING OF JESUS HAVE BEEN FULFILLED IN THE PERSON OF MIRZA GHULAM AHMAD OF QADIAN (1835–1908)

And in the following sentence he has repeated his claim:
But I have also seen PROPHECIES FULFILLED and signs of the truth of Ahmad (as).

Our Baha’i friends have produced satisfying proofs, but none is from the Islamic Traditions. Following is just a comparison on the fulfillment of some of the Islamic prophecies regarding the return of Mahdi by the Bab and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad:

(I). The Two Promised Ones of Islam are expected by Muslims to rise successively one after another, but in Ahmadiyya, "Messiah" and "Mahdi" are synonymous terms for one and the same person, namely Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.
Sunni Muslims are expecting at three individuals to appear in the Time of the End, Mahdi a good man, Anti-Christ an evil man, and Jesus Christ a good man.
Sa'id ibn-i Jabir reported the following Hadith from Ibn-i Abbas, who heard it from Prophet Muhammad Who said:
"My successors after Me are God's proofs for the people of the earth. They are twelve. First one of them my brother and last of them will be my child. They asked: O Apostle of God who is your brother? He said Ali-ibn Abu Talib. They asked who is your child? He said: He is Mahdi who will fill the earth with justice, even if it is full of injustice and wretchedness. I swear to God Who made Me His Messenger even if one day is left from the age of the world, God will lengthen that day to the extent that My child Mahdi will become manifest. Then Isa [Maseeh], the Spirit of God (the Return of Christ) descends from heaven and prays behind Him).
According to Sunni sources: Allamih Jalal'ud'Din Suyooti in his book "Al Araf'ul Vardi fi Akhbaar al-Mahdi" offers a Hadith narrated by Ibn Abbas:
"The Messenger of God said: Al Mahdi is from My Household [He will arise from Muhammad's family line]. He will arise as the Vicegerent of God [Kalifa-tullah] and afterward HE WILL RELEGATE HIS RULERSHIP TO ISA BIN MARYAM (Jesus)”.
This expectation of the appearance of two Divine Manifestations affirmed in the Qur’an too, as follows:
“And the Horn will be blown, and whoever is in the heavens and whoever is on the earth will fall dead except whom Allah wills. Then it will be blown again, and at once they will be standing, looking on.
And the earth will shine with THE LIGHT OF ITS LORD, (*) and the record [of deeds] will be placed, and the prophets and the witnesses will be brought, and it will be judged between them in truth, and they will not be wronged. (Qur’an, 39:68-69) (*). The title of Baha’u’llah which means, The Glory of God.

This prophecy fulfilled by the Bab and Baha’u’llah, while didn’t fulfil by Ahmad.

(II). The Mahdi according to Muslim Traditions will be a descendant of the Prophet Muhammad of the line of Fatima:
The Prophet said: The Mahdi will be of my family, of the descendants of Fatimah [Muhammad’s daughter]. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 36, Number 4271 Narrated by Umm Salamah, Ummul-Mu'minin).
Abu Dawud also reported a hadith about the Mahdi that Muhammad said: “The Mahdi will be of my stock, and will have a broad forehead, a prominent nose and a mark on his right cheek. He will fill the earth with equity and justice as it was filled with oppression and tyranny, and HE WILL RULE FOR SEVEN YEARS”.
Abu Sa`id al-Khudri said: The Messenger of Allah said: "He is one of us”.
The Messenger of Allah said: "The Mahdi is of my lineage, with a high forehead and a long, thin, curved nose. He will fill the earth with fairness and justice as it was filled with oppression and injustice, and HE WILL RULE FOR SEVEN YEARS”. (*)

Regarding the subject, Qulam Ahmad wrote himself:
"I do not claim that I am the same Mahdi who will come according to (words of Hadith) 'from the son of Fatima and from my progeny' etc." (Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya V, Roohani Khazain vol.21 p.356).

While the Bab was from the seed of Muhammad, the Prophet:

“ … He Who, both on His father's and mother's side, was of the seed of the illustrious Fatimih, and Who was a descendant of the Imam Husayn, the most eminent among the lawful successors of the Prophet of Islam….” (Shoghi Effendi, God Passes By, p. 9).


(*) For Sunni sources see Ibn Maja, {Sunan}, p. 1367, No. 4085; at-Tirmidhi, {Sunan}, Vol. 2, p. 36; Abu Dawud, {Sunan}, Vol. 2, p. 422. For Shi'is the Mahdi is the Twelfth Imam who was, of course, a descendant of Muhammad.]

(III). The Mahdi will rule for either SEVEN, NINE, or NINETEEN years, (*) before the Day of Judgment (The Day of Resurrection) and will rid the world of evil.


The Declaration of the Bab was on May, 1844 (Fifth of Jamadiyu'l-Avval,1260 A.H.) and the Martyrdom of the Bab was on 9 July, 1850 (28th Sha’ban, 1266 A.H.) = He martyred in the seventh year of His Declaration ; THE DIFFERENCE IS SEVEN YEARS.

The Declaration of the Bab was on May, 1844 (Fifth of Jamadiyu'l-Avval,1260 A.H.) and The intimation of His Revelation to Baha'u'llah in the Siyah-Chal of Ṭihran, was in 15th October 1852 (Muharram, 1269 A.H.) = THE DIFFERENCE IS NINE YEARS.
The Declaration of the Bab was on May, 1844 (Fifth of Jamadiyu'l-Avval,1260 A.H.) and the Open Declaration of Baha’u’llah’s Mission in Ridvan was on 21st April, 1863 (3rd Di’l-Qaidih 1279 A.H.) = THE DIFFERENCE IS NINETEEN YEARS.

(*) For Sunni sources see at-Tirmidhi, {Sunan}, Vol. 2, p. 36; Abu Dawud, {Sunan}, Vol. 2, pp. 422-3. For Shi'i sources see, for example, al-Irbili, {Kashf al-Ghumma}, Vol. 3, pp. 257, 269; al-Nu'mani, {al-Ghayba} quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol. 13, p. 178.]

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Re: Claim of Ahmad as the Messiah

Postby iranpour » Sun Apr 20, 2014 3:53 am

(IV). Mahdi will be seen performing Tawaf (to go round circumambulation) in Mecca during the period of Hajj.
We read in the Baha’i History that in the second month of Sha'ban, of the year 1260 A.H. (September, 1844) the Bab proceeded, in fulfilment of Islamic traditions, to visit the Ka’bih. This pilgrimage accompanied by His last disciple, Quddus and His faithful Ethiopian servant, Mubarak. There He revealed an EPISTLE TO THE SHERIF OF MECCA, IN WHICH THE CUSTODIAN OF THE HOUSE OF GOD WAS CALLED UPON TO EMBRACE THE TRUTH OF THE NEW REVELATION. After finishing the Hajj, when all the pilgrims were present at the precinct and the flat roof of the Ka’bih, He put his back to the wall of the Haram when handling the ring of the door of Ka’bih, three times with a loud voice repeated the following words fluently and eloquently: “I AM THE QA’IM WHOM YOU WERE WAITING FOR”. Then He visited Medina and from Jeddah, He returned back to His own country and there He bade His last farewell to “His disciple and His fellow-traveller and told them that He would meet the beloved of His heart (Imam Husayn), and would suffer a similar fate, namely martyrdom, at the hands of Their common foe.(*)

Regarding Ahmadiyyih, they have written:
“As mentioned before Mirza never visited the holy lands of Makka and Madina and hence never performed a hajj or an ‘umra in his life nor did he ever have the opportunity to visit the grave of the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم and greet him by his graveside in person”. (From: The Mahdi, the Messiah and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad)

So, this prophecy fulfilled by the Bab and did not fulfil by Ahmad.

(V). His coming will be accompanied by THE RAISING OF A BLACK STANDARD IN KHURASAN. These Traditions state: “If you see it [the Black Standard] then go to it even if you have to crawl over the snow, for with it is the Mahdi, the vicegerent of God”[/quote].

In the Baha’i history, we read as follows:

“ … As soon as that message (of the Bab) reached him, Mullá Ḥusayn arose to execute the wishes of his Master. Leaving Mashhad for a place situated at a farsang’s distance from the city, he hoisted the Black Standard, placed the turban of the Báb upon his head, assembled his companions, mounted his steed, and gave the signal for their march to the Jazíriy-i-Khadrá. His companions, who were two hundred and two in number, enthusiastically followed him. That memorable day was the nineteenth of Sha’bán, in the year 1264 A.H. Wherever they tarried, at every village and hamlet through which they passed, Mullá Ḥusayn and his fellow-disciples would fearlessly proclaim the message of the New Day, would invite the people to embrace its truth, and would select from among those who responded to their call a few whom they would ask to join them on their journey ….” (The Dawn-Breakers: Nabíl’s Narrative of the Early Days of the Bahá’í Revelation. P. 325).

So the prophecy fulfilled by the Bab but did not fulfil by Ahmad.

(*). For Sunni sources see Ibn Maja, {Sunan}, p. 1367, No. 4084; see also p. 1366, No. 4082. For Shi'i sources see al-Irbili, {Kashf al-Ghumma}, Vol 3, p. 262-3; Shay khu't-Ta'ifa, {al-Ghayba}, quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol. 13, p. 159.].

(VI). The Mahdi will do what the Prophet did. HE WILL DEMOLISH WHATEVER PRECEDES HIM just as the Prophet demolished the structure of the Time of Ignorance ({al-Jahiliyya} -- the period before Islam).
[Al-Nu'mani, {al-Ghayba}, quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol. 13, p. 191.]

There is an article of Ahmadiyyih in response of the question: “What is the difference between Ahmadi Muslims and other Muslims?
It says that: It is a revivalist movement that has no new religious laws or teachings as it seeks to rejuvenate the true Islam as taught by the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw).
As with all other Muslims, Ahmadi Muslims believe in the ‘Five Pillars of Islam’, and the ‘Six Articles of Faith’. They follow the same holy scripture (The Holy Qur’an), and accept that Islam is the final and perfect religion for mankind. They also believe in Prophet Muhammad (saw) as Khataman Nabiyyeen (the ‘Seal of the Prophets’) as he was the one who was the best model for mankind who brought God’s final and perfect message for mankind.

Here we see that Ahmad did not abrogate the Islamic laws but the Bab Renewed the Faith of Islam which was preceded His Faith.

So the Bab fulfilled the prophecy but Ahmad did not fulfil it.

(VII). The Mahdi would come with A NEW FAITH AND NEW LAW”:

“HE WILL COME WITH A NEW CAUSE -- just as Muhammad, at the beginning of Islam, summoned the people to a new Cause -- AND WITH A NEW BOOK AND A NEW RELIGIOUS LAW (SHARI'A), which will be a severe test for the Arabs”
. (*)

The Bab established a New Faith and New Laws but Ahmadiyyih believe themselves as Muslims: Ahmadi Muslims also follow the Islamic sources of guidance and jurisprudence– which is sourced from three main authorities:
1. The Holy Qur’an;
2. The Sunnah (practice of the Holy Prophet (saw)); and
3. The Hadith (sayings of the Holy Prophet(saw)) as given in the authentic books of Hadith such as Sahih Al Bukhari, Sahih Al Muslim, Sunan Abu Daud,Tirmidhi, Ibne Maja and Nisai
As mentioned before, Ahmad did not abrogate the law of Islam, and consequently did not present A NEW BOOK AND A NEW RELIGIOUS LAW. So the prophecy fulfilled by the Bab but did not fulfil by Ahmad.

(*). [Al-Nu'mani, {al-Ghayba}, quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol 13, pp. 192, 194; al mufid, {al-Irshad}, p. 343 (Tr. 552); al-Irbili, {Kashf al-Ghumma}, Vol. 3, p. 255.] TO BE CONTINUED

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Re: Claim of Ahmad as the Messiah

Postby iranpour » Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:43 pm

(VIII). When the Qá'im arises, will experience as a result of the ignorance of the people worse than what the Apostle of God experienced at the hands of the ignorant people of the Time of Ignorance because the Apostle of God came to a people who worshipped stones and wood but the Qá'im will come to a people who will interpret the Book of God against him and will bring forward proofs from it against him. When the flag of the Qá'im is raised, the people of both East and West will curse it.
[Al-Nu'mani, {al-Ghayba}, quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol. 13, p. 193.].

This prophecy fulfilled completely by the Bab which was testified by His martyrdom and the blood of twenty thousand martyrs. I don’t know about opposition to Ahmadiyyih, but as they believed to be Muslims, there must be no opposition.

(IX). All knowledge is encompassed in 27 letters and all that the messengers of God have brought is two of these letters, and so the people only know these two letters. But when the Qá'im will arise, he will bring forth the other 25 letters and will spread them among the people. (*)

When we consider the numerous revelation of the Bab, we will confess that the prophecy fulfilled completely by Him and nobody can rival Him.
(*). [Qutbu'd-Din Rawandi, {al-Khara'ij}, quoted in Majlisi, {Bihar al-Anwar} (old ed.), Vol. 13, p. 187.]

(X). People will flee from him [the Mahdi] as sheep flee from the shepherd. Later, people will begin to look for a purifier. But since they can find none to help them but him, they will begin to run to him.
This prophecy fulfilled by the Bab as the people were fleeing from Him but later the world embraced His Cause and now the Baha’i Faith is the second most distributed religion in the world after Christianity.

(XI). The sun will rise from the West and a star will appear in the East giving out as much light as the moon. (*)

Baha’u’llah, the return of Isa, the SUN OF TRUTH, BORN IN THE EAST and ROSE FROM THE WEST by His exile, and His star as was seen by the Magi, in His first coming, was seen in Iran in His return:

TAYMUR KHARAZMI, from Isfahan who was one of the well-known astronomers of the time, made known that by the instructions of the Qur’an, the astronomical condition from 1330 to 1350 A.H. showed that a cause will appear which causes radical changes in the world. Another astronomer from Isfahan, was AQAKHAN who was living in Nasr-Abad, near Isfahan, who was the astronomer of Manuchihr Khan Mu’tamidu’d-Dulih the ruler of Isfahan. He made known that somebody would appear in the world that by His appearance the laws of the faith would be renewed, because His star had appeared in the sky and he were mentioning his experience in the assemblies of the learned and great men. He was emphasizing in his views that he who would live till 1260, would see the strange things. And when they were asking him regarding the strange things, his response was that there needs be appear somebody like Moses, Jesus or Muhammad who will bring a new religion. (Translated from Kitab-i-Faraid (The Book of Faraid), p. 337).

The prophecy fulfilled by the Bab and Baha’u’llah but did not fulfil by Ahmad.
(*). [Al-Mufid, {al-Irshad}, p. 336 (Tr. 541).]
(XII). Isa (Jesus) will appear during the lifetime of Imam Mahdi. He will descend from heaven on a cloud… Isa will "BREAK THE CROSS" (1) and "kill the swine”. Thereafter, ALL WARS WILL END, INCLUDING JIHAD, (2) and people will return to their own countries (3). PEACE WILL BE ON THE EARTH, (4) and there will be an abundance of crops. PEOPLE WILL WORSHIP ONE GOD. ISA WILL MARRY, HAVE CHILDREN (5)…”.
(From: “Prophecy: A History of the Future” By: Robert A. Nelson.)
Sahih al-Bukhari, 3:43:656: Narrated Abu Hurairah: Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until the son of Maryam (Jesus) descends amongst you as a just ruler; he will break the cross, kill the swine, and abolish the Jizya (tax on non-Muslims). Wealth will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it."

"It is possible and quite possible that at some time in future such Messiah may appear upon whom the literal words of Hadith (of Holy Prophet) fit, because this humble self has not come with the Reign and Command of this world, but with poverty and humility." (Izala-e-Auham, Roohani Khazain vol 3 p.197).

(1). He would NOT be crucified as His first return as is prophesied by Jesus in the parable of Vineyard (Matthew 20:1–16)

(2). He has nullified any kind of fighting including the Holy-War or Jihad.
(3). The return of Jews to their homeland in the second coming of Jesus is prophesied in the Bible, the Qur’an (and by Baha’u’llah and ‘Abdu’l-Baha before the establishment of the State of Israel).

(4). One of the Social Teachings of Baha’u’llah is “The Universal Peace”.
(5). Contrary to His first coming, Who has not time to marry, Baha’u’llah married and had children in His Return.

The prophecies in the Qur’an and Islamic Traditions and in the Bible regarding the Bab and Baha’u’llah’s title, the place where They arise, the date of Their coming and the signs of Their appearance is not mentioned here and are the subject of other discussions.

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